Curse

Francis Demeules · Jun 01, 2006, 12:59 PM // 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theos

I think he meant why a trapper when you could bring a water ele to do much the same and not become useless against ranged mobs.

*Blurred Vision for M. Giant Horn with big Axe
*Deep Freeze on aggro mobs follow by Nuke meteor shower (if they try to scatter away, they will move slowly)
*Ice spike, Ice shards are included to slow the mobs.

*And Water magic have Ward against Harm [E]

Im off for now. Im going at my job.

Avarre · Jun 01, 2006, 01:26 PM // 13:26

The aspect of fear has a place where you stand in a corner and large groups of mobs rush you from all sides (thats where we died). Snares are no use because they're already there, we need the traps to deal out blind, scatter, and aoe damage.

Also, 90% blind > 50% evade chance, degen is also more powerful against kanaxai (ignores the damn damage cap)

Because aggro generally goes all over the place, the trapper snares are just as effective since the frontline becomes nearly nonexistant.

Shanaeri Rynale · Jun 01, 2006, 01:30 PM // 13:30

another important factor is that you cannot use anything that will produce a knockdown near kanaxxi. KD's need to be managed and a trapper deals out lots of damage with no fear of unadvertant knockdowns

Theos · Jun 01, 2006, 04:16 PM // 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

The aspect of fear has a place where you stand in a corner and large groups of mobs rush you from all sides (thats where we died). Snares are no use because they're already there, we need the traps to deal out blind, scatter, and aoe damage.

Also, 90% blind > 50% evade chance, degen is also more powerful against kanaxai (ignores the damn damage cap)

Because aggro generally goes all over the place, the trapper snares are just as effective since the frontline becomes nearly nonexistant.

Ok that makes sense now, I didn't know how the room layout was exactly, I assumed that it was more of a over-time rush not an all at once warzone.

fiery · Jun 01, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

Spam distortion

.

Evilsod · Jun 01, 2006, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Also, 90% blind > 50% evade chance, degen is also more powerful against kanaxai (ignores the damn damage cap)

That would've been my next point

The blind duration is extremely low though on Dust Trap these days. I swear that Blurred Vision is bugged too, when in FoW i've missed so many more times than i've hit its ridiculous. My ratio of hitting them to missing is about 1:3 and i'm not kidding either. Missed 8 attacks in a row yesterday.

Sadly not everyone is as dedicated as Dunham

Theos · Jun 01, 2006, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

That would've been my next point

The blind duration is extremely low though on Dust Trap these days. I swear that Blurred Vision is bugged too, when in FoW i've missed so many more times than i've hit its ridiculous. My ratio of hitting them to missing is about 1:3 and i'm not kidding either. Missed 8 attacks in a row yesterday.

Sadly not everyone is as dedicated as Dunham

You could always run an Attuned Flash Turret... with the recent buff to the Attunments you can keep them up indefinately and they will make Blinding Flash only cost ~5 energy, add BiP to it...

Eaimirth Etaivella · Jun 01, 2006, 09:48 PM // 21:48

BF Spam, add e charge and we have a fc "nuker" which is nothing more than war hate so it baffles me why they have the nuker title...but its a title build nonetheless.

Still good war hate when people are too dumb to bring martyr (pve, low lvl guilds, etc.)

Francis Demeules · Jun 01, 2006, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

The aspect of fear has a place where you stand in a corner and large groups of mobs rush you from all sides (thats where we died). Snares are no use because they're already there, we need the traps to deal out blind, scatter, and aoe damage.

Also, 90% blind > 50% evade chance, degen is also more powerful against kanaxai (ignores the damn damage cap)

Because aggro generally goes all over the place, the trapper snares are just as effective since the frontline becomes nearly nonexistant.

That's explain all on what I wondered why a trapper. Off course degen is now powerful since they put Image of Remorse from Faction.

So... how do you think to make the Trapper with a mesmer?

??

Dust Trap
Snare
Flame trap
Viper Nest/Barbed Trap
Healing Spring
Spike Trap [E]
Serpent Quickness
Rez/Troll

??

I wonder if we put the last mesmer (Writed whateva!) with fevered dreams to spread conditions to every foes in its area? Or maybe using another Bip or tank thought...

Desert Penguin · Jun 01, 2006, 11:05 PM // 23:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

Spam distortion

.

That doesn't sound too friendly for your Energy

I remember in 4vs4 PvP, my Wa/Mo went head-to-head with a Mesmer, all he ever did was spam distortion, because he lost so much energy from dodging my attacks, he barely had the energy to heal himself and I killed him!

Eaimirth Etaivella · Jun 01, 2006, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Well...assuming you attack once per second(give you tiger's furry or whatever, frenzy doesn't matter)...and with energy regen of 1.3 pips per second. This will continue for 5 seconds upon which the mesmer will have gained 6 and 2/3 points of energy but lost 3.75 due to your attacks (miss rate of 25%) the mesmer still has a net gain of 2.58 points which are then used to reactivate distortion at a cost of 5 energy for a net loss of 2.5~ energy. With 52 energy/2.5=20.8x5=104 seconds before the mesmer would run out of energy at standpoint ignoring energy gaining skills. We can then add kiting etc to reduce the energy lost...not sure how you killed the mesmer. GJ though.

Avarre · Jun 02, 2006, 01:45 AM // 01:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Francis Demeules

Dust Trap
Snare
Flame trap
Viper Nest/Barbed Trap
Healing Spring
Spike Trap [E]
Serpent Quickness
Rez/Troll

??

I wonder if we put the last mesmer (Writed whateva!) with fevered dreams to spread conditions to every foes in its area? Or maybe using another Bip or tank thought...

Dust Trap
Barbed Trap
Healing Spring
Echo {E}
Serpent's quickness (you got to love it, Eaimirth)
Flame Trap
Sympathetic Visage
Res

Or something cool like that.

Fevered would be low use 'cause most conditions are aoe-triggered, and the targetted mob that would get any that aren't dies fairly fast

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

Spam distortion

.

Not everyone wants to spec 8 or 13 illu and bring an additional skill

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella

BF Spam, add e charge and we have a fc "nuker" which is nothing more than war hate so it baffles me why they have the nuker title...but its a title build nonetheless.

BF spam loses to aoe blind in tight areas, and in other places blind from a dedicated mesmer isn't needed... what are you gonna blind?

Flash doesn't last long either, you'd get a few enemies blind... but overall not a good use of the slot. Could try though.

Fc nuker : fire mesmer with rodgorts, meteor shower, etc. Henchwaying with 2 of them I've killed teams in <50s. Clearly nuking must have took place.

Fc spiker : air mesmer with orb, strike, charge. 4-5 of them produce 600-750 damage on AL60, or so. And they do it like lightning!

Eaimirth, you don't know if they mes had 13 illu. Some just get 8 or so for the -2.

Eaimirth Etaivella · Jun 02, 2006, 02:43 AM // 02:43

True; they could have had -2...*sigh*
I would say epidemic on the BF but I hate epidemic so much due to its high cost and small AoE my spite of the skill won't let me.

Francis Demeules · Jun 02, 2006, 03:00 AM // 03:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella

True; they could have had -2...*sigh*
I would say epidemic on the BF but I hate epidemic so much due to its high cost and small AoE my spite of the skill won't let me.

It costs 10 and recharge faster now Eaim, since the last skill update before Faction comes out. I know the Adj area suck with it, but it cost at least for this one. Well, last time I used Fevered dreams, it doesnt trigger the scatter (maybe I just did Bleed and Deepwound as a Me/W with sword)

One more thing Avarre, I hope the one will be Trapper will be glad to do not being easy interrupted

. You know what I mean...

Theos · Jun 02, 2006, 03:03 AM // 03:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eaimirth Etaivella

True; they could have had -2...*sigh*
I would say epidemic on the BF but I hate epidemic so much due to its high cost and small AoE my spite of the skill won't let me.

Drop Elemental Attunment for the arguably large AoE of Fevered Dreams. Dust Trap seems like a weak option with its high energy cost and short duration, its also interuptable so :/

This will really be decided by a test, to many theoreticals.

Avarre · Jun 02, 2006, 03:21 AM // 03:21

Quote:

Dust Trap seems like a weak option with its high energy cost and short duration,

Energy cost same as Blinding flash fevered, and flash lasts even less time total.

It also is completely useless when mobs rush you in comparison. Ill take the 10 degen, cripple, and blindness + aoe scatter for people to open fire over managing to blind a few of them depending on the spread pattern.

For most other areas, blind isn't even needed. Kanaxai aspects aren't a problem with more than 3 (and killable with 3), and Kanaxai himself gets bodyblocked... versus him, anyone can be a tank (every hit has to be capped with prot spirit anyway, and with block enchants..)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Francis Demeules

One more thing Avarre, I hope the one will be Trapper will be glad to do not being easy interrupted . You know what I mean...

Trapper traps area the tank will tank near, to deal damage once battle starts and also if aggro loss, traps around other mesmers, much like warder. During fights like aspect of fear, pretrap and trap with other players tanking. For kanaxai, trap from behind tanks...

Theos · Jun 02, 2006, 03:26 AM // 03:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

Energy cost same as Blinding flash fevered, and flash lasts even less time total.

It also is completely useless when mobs rush you in comparison. Ill take the 10 degen, cripple, and blindness + aoe scatter for people to open fire over managing to blind a few of them depending on the spread pattern.

For most other areas, blind isn't even needed. Kanaxai aspects aren't a problem with more than 3 (and killable with 3), and Kanaxai himself gets bodyblocked... versus him, anyone can be a tank (every hit has to be capped with prot spirit anyway, and with block enchants..)

Trapper traps area the tank will tank near, to deal damage once battle starts and also if aggro loss, traps around other mesmers, much like warder. During fights like aspect of fear, pretrap and trap with other players tanking. For kanaxai, trap from behind tanks...

Ahh, I see now. So then it is not fully as I thought it was. I was under the impression that, in the area where the dust trap is needed, you are simply assaulted by an army without much preparation time; this is why I was unsure of using traps. So now I assume you actually have some time to actually lay the traps before getting bombarded.

Avarre · Jun 02, 2006, 03:44 AM // 03:44

There is a brief reprieve after arriving to set things up, even without much time my point would hold, the rest of the team in such a situation could bodyblock (with aegis up) until first dust trap went off. Traps would also help in places where you cannot cast spells (rspike room ftw!).

Theos · Jun 02, 2006, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avarre

There is a brief reprieve after arriving to set things up, even without much time my point would hold, the rest of the team in such a situation could bodyblock (with aegis up) until first dust trap went off. Traps would also help in places where you cannot cast spells (rspike room ftw!).

Did you run wards or was all protection dependant on the over-abundant monks. If this were the case you could drop a Me/Mo for a Me/E earth that can act both as protection and as a semi-effective offense, I assume ofcourse there is room to kyte.

Since there is a lack of "agro" takers from what I can notice from pictures the group supplied, you could run a Shockwave warder for some interesting combinations with traps. Something along the lines of:

Aftershock
Shockwave
Ward Against Melee
Ward Against Foes
Earth Attunment
Res
~ Obsidian Flame + Glyph of Lesser Energy
or
~ Auspicious Incantation + Arcane Echo

The latter is more fragile as it takes alot of time to really get going, while the first is a "decent" e-management possibility with a finishing skill; it is also the only one to cause exhaust so I doubt that would be a problem.

Avarre · Jun 02, 2006, 06:28 AM // 06:28

We had 1 warder (geraldine). 1 of the Me/Mo was also illusion, not healer (doyle).

And typically, if you really want to hold aggro you should have only 1 tank. His main purpose is to tank the aspects anyway, since aggro gets splattered all over the place, caught in wards, nuked, etc most of the time on our group